Celery Powder & Corned Beef

Kijek
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Celery Powder & Corned Beef

Post by Kijek » Wed Feb 28, 2018 13:59

I always use cure #2 when making my corned beef, but to be somewhat healthier, thought I might try celery juice powder instead.
I done all the reading I can and know that this way will be considered an "in-cured" product, etc.

But what your thoughts on this natural curing agent? Is it no healthier or safer?
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Bob K
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Post by Bob K » Wed Feb 28, 2018 14:31

Why use cure #2 for corned beef?

The sodium nitrate in celery is no different than the sodium nitrate in cure #2, NaNO3 is still NaNO3, no matter the source.

:lol: :lol: :lol:
Butterbean wrote:So if you use the celery stuff you can dump all you want in the meat and it will be considered "nitrate free". If you grow a leg out your ear you probably added too much.
One of many discussions on the subject of celery for cures
http://wedlinydomowe.pl/en/viewtopic.ph ... orned+beef
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Post by redzed » Wed Feb 28, 2018 15:58

Again, absolutely no need to add nitrates to pastrami. I once asked my doctor if I should take vitamin pills. He answered to go ahead and take them if I think they will help. So if you think you you will feel better if you add nitrites to your products in the form of celery juice powder, go ahead.

As to using Cure #1, keep in mind that 2.5g per kg is 156ppm, which is the maximum allowed amount in the US. In Canada it's even higher, 200ppm. And there is a huge misunderstanding about this number among amateur sausage makers, in that they think that they have to use this maximim amount and even add more for good measure. If you are concerned about nitrates, lower amount of Cure #1 by 50% to 100ppm, and your product will still be safe and taste the same. In Denmark the limit is only 80ppm and in a country that consumes a lot of sausages, I have never heard od people getting sick. I use 2g/kg which is 120ppm and what most Europeans use.
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Post by Kijek » Wed Feb 28, 2018 20:53

Why use cure #2 for corned beef?
That is what the recipe calls for that I've used for years now, it comes from the book "CHARCUTERIE" by Michael Ruhlman. It's a delicious corn beef recipe, Love it!
Well, I guess I will give it a try without cure, and I have thought about it before, no cure is not going to change the flavor one bit.



lower amount of Cure #1 by 50% to 100ppm
That is my bottom line for using cures.
At least I would have thought you may need cure #1 in the pastrami, but if you say no, I believe you.
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Post by Bob K » Wed Feb 28, 2018 21:45

Actually what we said was there is no need for cure#2 containing nitrate in either pastrami or corned beef. It still needs to be cured with cure #1. But I can see how you were misled to believe no cure :cry:

Cure will definitely change the flavor and texture of meat.

In the book Charcuterie both the pastrami and corned beef recipes call for cure #1 not cure #2 so you should review your notes :oops:
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Post by Kijek » Wed Feb 28, 2018 22:55

I understand, and I see in the book is says PINK Salt, I assumed that was #2.
I have both #1 & #2 cures and both are pink, and I do have some #1 that is white.

So if the recipe calls for PINK that is always #1?

Most recipes I do see call for cure by number, not by color, so in the case of this corned beef, I was totally wrong in assuming.

Thanks for clearing that up. :oops:
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Post by Butterbean » Thu Mar 01, 2018 04:45

Yes, pink salt is the term for cure 1.
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Post by Kijek » Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:57

Thanks butters
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Post by DanMcG » Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:59

Forget the color of the salt, If you're doing a short term cure like corned beef or smoked sausage then you want Cure #1 which contains nitrite. For a long term cure like a ham or salami you want cure #2 which contains nitrate .
I hope this helps.
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Post by Kijek » Thu Mar 01, 2018 12:12

Thanks Dan
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Post by redzed » Thu Mar 01, 2018 16:05

I wish that people would stop using the term "pink" salt without specifying which one. Sounds like you're talking to a toddler, and in Canada and the UK, where we also use the same formulation, curing salts are not coloured. So it's confusing since both #1 and #2 are tinted (with C Red #3). And then we get the perennial question whether Pink Himalayan salt is the same? :roll: :grin:
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Post by Knifeman » Thu Mar 01, 2018 16:54

redzed wrote:Again, absolutely no need to add nitrates to pastrami. I once asked my doctor if I should take vitamin pills. He answered to go ahead and take them if I think they will help. So if you think you you will feel better if you add nitrites to your products in the form of celery juice powder, go ahead.

As to using Cure #1, keep in mind that 2.5g per kg is 156ppm, which is the maximum allowed amount in the US. In Canada it's even higher, 200ppm. And there is a huge misunderstanding about this number among amateur sausage makers, in that they think that they have to use this maximim amount and even add more for good measure. If you are concerned about nitrates, lower amount of Cure #1 by 50% to 100ppm, and your product will still be safe and taste the same. In Denmark the limit is only 80ppm and in a country that consumes a lot of sausages, I have never heard od people getting sick. I use 2g/kg which is 120ppm and what most Europeans use.
Hello Redzed Not that I'm at that stage yet but is there a formula for figuring out how many PPM ?
Thanks
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Post by redzed » Thu Mar 01, 2018 17:01

A very good lesson in calculating the amounts of ingoing nitrite is here:
http://www.malabarsuperspice.com/ref_nitrate.htm

But if you can't find your pencil, :grin: you can use this calculator on our website:
https://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausag ... calculator
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Post by Kijek » Thu Mar 01, 2018 17:56

perennial question whether Pink Himalayan salt is the same?
As dumb as I am, I knew that one. :lol:
wish that people would stop using the term "pink" salt
Me too, that's what screwed me up.
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Post by Knifeman » Thu Mar 01, 2018 21:35

redzed wrote:A very good lesson in calculating the amounts of ingoing nitrite is here:
http://www.malabarsuperspice.com/ref_nitrate.htm

But if you can't find your pencil, :grin: you can use this calculator on our website:
https://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausag ... calculator
Thanks Redzed !
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