Project "A"

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uwanna61
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Post by uwanna61 » Fri Jul 29, 2011 01:20

Hey all
My project has lost major weight, I`m at day 50 as of today and the end weight sets in at 56 - 59 % weight loss. Another 30 days, I will little smokies. Below are a few pic`s of the project. The texture seems ok, but major weight loss. I did strip the casing off one (see picture) and took a slice. Taste is good, a little on the salty side, but with cracker & cheese not bad! The incubator temperature (inside) reads 52 deg, and the humidity level set at 72%
One question comes to mind: Would the time of year, during hot/ dry days have an effect on curing salamis? I have read that the colder months ending with R, typically are the months to ferment and dry cure salamis.
Sorry for large pic's, but I know CW's gonna want a close up :wink:

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Post by ssorllih » Fri Jul 29, 2011 02:41

Mine should look so good!
Ross- tightwad home cook
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Post by Chuckwagon » Fri Jul 29, 2011 11:32

Hi guys...

DaveZac in Western New York reports: "I've got RH around 70 this past week and temp at 58-60 with heat wave." Dave also said the magic words: "I am dying to try it". We`ll give him 10 points just for that remark eh? (I`m just worried about the amount of snow you`ll be pushin` six months from now!)

Ross Hill in Maryland says: "Weight loss ranges from 36 percent to about 48 percent. With the moisture content not uniform through the diameter. Not case hardened but not uniformly dry. The tapered ends are more uniform. I had one sausage that was stuffed with the left overs from the three varieties that i made and we ate that last night. We agreed that the taste was good but the texture needs to improve".

Uwanna in Vermont reports: "My project has lost major weight, I`m at day 50 as of today and the end weight sets in at 56 - 59 % weight loss. Another 30 days, I will [have] little smokies. Below are a few pic`s of the project. The texture seems ok, but major weight loss. I did strip the casing off one (see picture) and took a slice.

Uwanna also wrote:
Taste is good, a little on the salty side, but with cracker & cheese not bad! The incubator temperature (inside) reads 52 deg, and the humidity level set at 72% . One question comes to mind: Would the time of year, during hot/ dry days have an effect on curing salamis? I have read that the colder months ending with R, typically are the months to ferment and dry cure salamis.

Uwanna, salt is important especially in this type of sausage as you know. However, the content does not change as the salami shrinks and loses moisture. The product only becomes saltier in taste until the end of the procedure, then will mysteriously dissipate somewhat. It is for this reason I use only Diamond-Crystal Kosher Salt; believe it or not, the stuff actually weighs LESS THAN HALF the weight of regular table salt. (Morton Kosher is somewhere in between). For the exact weights, see page 189 in Stan`s book, "Home Production Of Quality Meats And Sausages".
Table salt often has sodium silicoaluminate or magnesium carbonate added to it to prevent moisture accumulation and caking. Sea salts have magnesium, nitrate, and calcium. Believe it or not, some sea salt (having been evaporated) has so much nitrate in it, that it will cure meat. But it is bitter. Always use the purest stuff you can lay your mitts on.
You asked about the time of year for making this stuff. The old time sausage-makers would certainly have to worry about that, but we`ve made "custom-made", temperature and humidity controlled atmosphere cabinets that just do not care whether it`s snowing or sunny outside. Storage will be a different matter entirely, as you again start they cycle with a new batch of fermented sausages utilizing your fermentation chamber. By the way, have you got any suggestions for our next project?

OK guys, let`s approach the next problem. We seem to have a high rate of moisture loss with a month to go. This means one or more of three possible problems:

1. Excessive drying - too fast air velocity - too low humidity.
2. Too fast acidification.
3. Applying a too fast acidifier (wrong culture).

I would strike the possibility of #3 and #2 as we seem to have proper acidification in a long-term fermentation culture of T-SPX. I would, at this point, ask you if you measured precisely 0.6 g. of Bactoferm ™ T-SPX. In just about two more weeks, the sausage should be showing some signs of full maturity. Please keep good notes for your next project. Record everything! You`ll never know when you`ll need them.

Look back through your notes. Did you FERMENT at 68°F. (20° C.) for 72 hours in 85% - 90% humidity?
The salamis should have DRIED at 57°F. (14°C.) in 80%-85% humidity.
Remember, that Stan`s directions said they could be dry after only 2 months. (extended finishing is 3). Kind folks and gentle people, In about 2 weeks, you`ll have Alysaandra Salami! The REAL thing! The "expensive" stuff that less than 1% of the people on earth ever taste. Congratulations craftsmen. I`m proud to be part of your project.

Ross, I am just a bit worried about yours with a loss of of 48%. It`s a bit high ol` pard. Can you post a cross-section photograph? That is just too much moisture loss at this point. With yet some time to go, if I were you, I`d really watch the RH carefully. I believe your air speed is too high and the RH drop may be too much too soon. Don`t dry it out too quickly.

Uwanna seems to have the secret. Your measurement of moisture loss is almost 60%? Uhhh... yup, that`s too high. Did you by chance, have added water with the initial mixture? Ice during grinding perhaps? The sausage does not appear to be overdried, but of course I'm not the one weighing it. I don't believe it is too dry. That sausage looks just as it should at this point. It`s not done yet and needs some more time for the staphylococci to finishing developing color and taste. This is evidenced by the moisture content although Uwanna seems to think it`s too dry. It looks good to me with the exception of the tiny beads of liquid that form on the newly exposed surface of the meat as a knife slices through it. This indicates a sausage that is just a bit immature - just right at this point. It also indicates that your room temperature is high and the salami has been sliced for twenty minutes. Uwanna, you may wish to cut any air speed altogether as you`ll be in the storage stage soon anyway. Simply open the door for a minute just once a day.

I have to tell you something at this point guys. You aren`t going to believe me. As we approach the finishing time for our project, please note that very few members chose to participate in Project "A". My hat is a Texas-made size 7-3/8 Resistol XXXX beaver - It is certainly off to you men! I congratulate you on finishing a project that most people will never even begin. Sadly, most will never even know the exquisite flavor of the "real" thing! Congratulations men. You`ve done a superior job. I`m so proud of you, I could just spit! And like I said when we started, "Yeeeee Hawwww"!

Best Wishes Yahoos!
Chuckwagon
Last edited by Chuckwagon on Tue Aug 09, 2011 02:28, edited 1 time in total.
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by uwanna61 » Fri Jul 29, 2011 17:17

CW
Well thank you big daddy with the beaver tail Stetson :wink: . This has been an experience, and I did learn a few things on this adventure, it`s all a learning curve and I appreciate your help and patience with the project :grin:
As discussed, earlier in the project I believe my fan speed & humidity level may have been off a little on my part. In another month or two I look forward to trying out the project S and a few more pepperoni recipes.
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Post by ssorllih » Fri Jul 29, 2011 20:45

When we dry lumber we allow one year per inch of thickness and figure that large timbers never come to equilibrium.
My sausages are stuffed in 60 MM casings. That was somewhat smaller than stated in the original recipe. Will the smaller diameter speed the drying time and do we still have a ripening period to complete?
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Post by partycook » Sat Jul 30, 2011 01:43

Fellow sausage makers
here is the update on my project.after 22 days my salami di Alessanddra had a weight loss of 30-32 per cent. after 39 days 39-40 per cent. temp. 57 humidity 75 per cent air speed slow. I also made project "S" and "P" Sopressata had a weight loss of 24-26 per cent after 21 days.I also made the pepperoni I must admit I used 1 1/2 inch fibrous casings. Weight loss after 21 days was between 36-42 per cent, these are in the same curing chamber as the projects "A" &"S" I am still trying to figure out how to post pictures .

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Post by Chuckwagon » Sat Jul 30, 2011 05:21

Hi Partycook,
Good to hear from you. You got a bit of a late start, but it's ok. We're with you bud! Only day 23 for you, compared with 50 days into the project by others. Perhaps you could slow your air speed and reduce the rate of drying just a bit - (delay the reduction in humidity).

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by Dave Zac » Sun Jul 31, 2011 17:40

My total weight loss is 25% for all for salamis. While the other seem to be running high, mine seems slow at this point doesn't it? I lost 5% over the last 2 weeks. At this rate I have 4 weeks to go. I am not running a fan at all. Should I turn it on very low? for the duration?
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Post by Chuckwagon » Mon Aug 01, 2011 01:47

Dave, it sounds like you are the only one who's clock is ticking straight. I'm still trying to figure out the rapid moisture loss in everyone else's project... (except yours). If I were you, I would slice an end off one sausage and test it. If needed, just continue as planned and wait it out. At this point, there is no need to turn on the fan if you simply remember to open the door each day for just a minute and change the air by waving a magazine or newspaper just for a moment or twelve! Something is definitely working for you! Got any ideas? How come your salami is drying slower than all the rest of us sinners? ... especially that card-cheatin', cussin', law-breakin', shoot 'em up womanizer Ross Hill... otherwise known at "RONGWAY"! Yup, and then there's the dudes on the "wanted posters" -partycook and uwanna! They have already bit into their sausage... they couldn't wait ya know! :roll:
I congratulate you on your patience, but we may wish to test one at this point! If it still needs weight loss, we can see what happens in yet another 30 days (if you can wait that long). Keep us posted ol' pard.

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon
Last edited by Chuckwagon on Tue Aug 02, 2011 11:34, edited 1 time in total.
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by ssorllih » Mon Aug 01, 2011 02:11

Sliced the end from a sausage this AM and it looks loik this.
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Post by Chuckwagon » Mon Aug 01, 2011 02:51

Ross, you are my pal, and I've kidded you all along.
However, I do believe that your sausage has been over-dried a bit. It is dark and "rimmed". The splits in the texture indicate too much (rapid) moisture withdrawal. In this particular sausage, the balance of equalibrium has not been satisfactorily achieved. I'm sorry ol' friend. I wish I could report otherwise. But it seems that you have "over" dried your product somehow. I cannot explain the problem because I was not there. For some reason, your project has dried prematurely. On the other hand, unexplained is... DaveZaks sausage... it seems to be right on schedule somehow. I don't know the answer. All I know is that you should not feel badly because Uwanna and Partycook's sausages have also dried a bit prematurely. I cannot explain the reason other than I have in the messages above.

OH,yes... I have my own theories all right. But... I don't know if anyone would be interested.

OK cowpokes! ... If it is one thing we've learned, it is that moisture loss MUST be uniform and very small... little increments of barely detectable amounts - day-by-day... until we see an overall loss that has been prescribed.

Ross, I truly wish I had better news. But, I believe you've dried your project too quickly. Perhaps it is still salvageable although the texture will not be correct. If the center is mushy and the rim is hard, then I'd toss it if I were you and learn from my mistakes. Take a look at all the factors regarding this project. Re-examine every little thing. Something has gone wrong somewhere.... IDENTIFY IT!
Sorry I can't be there to help you my friend. I am still trusting and hoping in your talents.
Go for it again my friend.

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by ssorllih » Mon Aug 01, 2011 03:34

I think that I know at least one factor. I have used ice as a cooling source. But ice melts at 32 degrees F and will condense water vapor while doing so. The times when I checked were times when most of the ice had melted. If I had in place a recording Hygrometer I suspect that i would have seen deep drops in the RH when fresh Ice was added to the chamber. I also suspect that there were corresponding drops in temperature. I am going to put a large aluminum pot filled with water in the chamber and put the ice in that and see if I can reduce the collected condensate. 20 pounds of 68 degree water won't fluctuate very much with the addition of a few pounds of ice. I can do this without any sausage hanging and just measure the collected condensate..
At present I have the sausages in plastic bags in the cold fridge and will let them languish there for a time or two.
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Post by ssorllih » Tue Aug 02, 2011 04:53

I am gonna find out if failed salami sausages make good catfish bait. I have seen 40 pound catfish pulled from this river. I have heard that smoked catfish is quite good. Nothing ventured , nothing gained.
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Post by Chuckwagon » Tue Aug 02, 2011 11:19

Ross, Here is a link to my "troubleshooting" page. You might wish to read some of the possible causes: http://wedlinydomowe.pl/en/viewtopic.php?t=4819
Stan is in Poland for a while. When he gets back, we'll tap into his smarts and see if we can come up with the answer. Meanwhile, DON'T become discouraged! We'll just "back up and hit it again"!

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it probably needs more time on the grill! :D
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Post by ssorllih » Tue Aug 02, 2011 13:49

Not to worry. I plant a garden each year some years the conditions are very poor and I don't get a good crop. This year the conditions are very good and the crop will be abundant.
I will studdy the trouble shooting page but I suspect that I know what happened.
Ross- tightwad home cook
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