Lots of liquid loss when canning spreadable ham

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wasuky
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Re: Lots of liquid loss when canning spreadable ham

Post by wasuky » Sat Apr 24, 2021 03:17

I have to bring this post alive as I tried a couple times the same recipe after my last comments in this post but have the same results. Some jars lose a little liquid, others lose a lot... everything in the same batch. So... I came back here again to re-read all the comments and found this line written by Stefan. I guess I read this so many times that I missed some things.
StefanS wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 00:13
In your recipe - really you do not need 121*C. Hopefully above short explanation will answer some of your questions.
Why would Stefan consider this recipe don't need the 121ºC treatment?
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Re: Lots of liquid loss when canning spreadable ham

Post by StefanS » Sat Apr 24, 2021 16:15

wasuky wrote:
Sat Apr 24, 2021 03:17
Why would Stefan consider this recipe don't need the 121ºC treatment?
1). how long and in which environmental you going to keep cooked jars?
2. what is purpose of that step? -
wasuky wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 16:57
[b]I grind the meat using a 5mm disc. Mix with the salt, sugar and curing salt. I then put the meat in mason jars and cook it at 75-80 ºC for 1hr.[/b] After it's cooked and a bit cold I break the meat and mix it with the rest of ingredients and then I grind it 2 more times using a 3mm disc. Then I finally put the meat in the final mason jar and in the pressure cooker for 1hour30min at 10psi. The caps are tighten using my finger tip.
3. In your description of process - inside pressure canner - jars not covered with water? is that correct?
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Re: Lots of liquid loss when canning spreadable ham

Post by wasuky » Sat Apr 24, 2021 19:34

StefanS wrote:
Sat Apr 24, 2021 16:15
how long and in which environmental you going to keep cooked jars?
Probably in a dark shelve at 28-32 °C (that's the average temp of this place, all year long). But I can certainly find a cooler place in the house (20-24°C). I would like to give them away as gift and don't know where they are going to end up (maybe in a hot place exposed to some sunlight).
StefanS wrote:
Sat Apr 24, 2021 16:15
hat is purpose of that step?

When I make this spreadable ham, I use to make 3-5Kg but I put everything into the fridge and we have to finish it in a couple days (we always end up giving it away in tuppers). As you would think, it uses a lot of space ib m fridge. The whole idea is to put the in jars so I could keep them out of the fridge and use it with no rush.
StefanS wrote:
Sat Apr 24, 2021 16:15
In your description of process - inside pressure canner - jars not covered with water? is that correct?
Yes. The big pressure canner I have has a separated metal thing that has no contact with water but I can use my regular pressure cooker (it gets to 11psi) in which everything has to be in the water.
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Re: Lots of liquid loss when canning spreadable ham

Post by StefanS » Sun Apr 25, 2021 01:06

I have on my mind that sentence - ""grind the meat using a 5mm disc. Mix with the salt, sugar and curing salt. I then put the meat in mason jars and cook it at 75-80 ºC for 1hr."" - what purpose is doing that.? grinding, cooking, again grinding and pasteurization....
Another tip - myself and my colleagues doing pasteurization in glass jars fully covered in water. Cooling period is guided as slow as possible to around 80*C ( 180F) inside canner.
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Re: Lots of liquid loss when canning spreadable ham

Post by wasuky » Sun Apr 25, 2021 15:58

StefanS wrote:
Sun Apr 25, 2021 01:06
I have on my mind that sentence - ""grind the meat using a 5mm disc. Mix with the salt, sugar and curing salt. I then put the meat in mason jars and cook it at 75-80 ºC for 1hr."" - what purpose is doing that.? grinding, cooking, again grinding and pasteurization....
Basically what I do with this first cooking is just that...to cook the meat (I tried in a fry pan at very slow temp but it was impossible to do an even cooking). That first round of heat cooks the meat and prevents it from binding again (which is what I want in my final product). After that I could just eat the thing (we always do if it's done around lunch time). The last one heat round is supposed to make it shelve stable at room temp for a long time (which is what I'm looking for) plus it ends up with a better taste and texture.
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Re: Lots of liquid loss when canning spreadable ham

Post by StefanS » Mon Apr 26, 2021 01:45

So lets start from beginning - In your recipe is nothing that can hold juice/water inside your mix. That recipe never will give you SPREADABLE meat mix only will give you liquid/jelly around of block of mince inside jar. There isn't nothing like, potato starch/corn starch, or vaporized dry milk. Your meat will be dry, crumbly inside of that block. It will shrink like it is on pictures. Process of sterilization in glass jars isn't that simple like in tin metal cans. Most important - full cover with water and letting jars to depressurize without pressure in canner during first 10-15 min. of boiling. Then it is finishing and cooling canner after process of pasteurization.
On polish site of WD is whole bunch of recipes for canned meats but i did not find anything similar to your spreadable hams.
It is my opinion.
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Re: Lots of liquid loss when canning spreadable ham

Post by wasuky » Mon Apr 26, 2021 16:17

:D it is actually an odd recipe and I have give it thought or two as maybe I could change the process and get the same result but I always end up thinking "if it works... Why change it?".

So, yes. After the first heat round, as I said, it ends up being a big block of meat. That's why I grind that block twice more in the 3mm plate to give it the texture I want. After that it has absorbed the liquid lost during that first cook. Once it has the texture I want, I add the spices and that's pretty much it. At that point it is a spreadable product. Once I added the spices before the 1st cook but it got an odd flavor (wasn't bad but I wasn't expecting it). Now, If you cook it again (the step I want to add) by Boling it at 100°C or 121°C, it gets a better texture, slightly different flavor and it stays spreadable.

You should give it a try with 100-200gr batch. It is actually pretty tasty.

Cheers! Thanks for your response. I really appreciate it.
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