Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Talk about anything here as long as it is not against the rules.
FF Diz
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New to Sausage making

Post by FF Diz » Sun Mar 28, 2021 18:01

Hi, i am new to the forum and to sausage making. i have just begun making homemade sausage. i am not looking to be an artisan, but i am looking for some tips and recipes for common sausage making. i have recently found the procedure for getting the texture right. i am looking for "Common" recipes. is there a place here where people post recipes here?
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redzed
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by redzed » Mon Mar 29, 2021 17:54

Hello FF Diz, and welcome to the forum! If you want to learn to make great sausages you found the right place! However, the world of sausages is vast and never ending. Sausages are made by a multitude of cultures and vary greatly. You will see a huge selection of sausage recipes in the link provided above and if you scroll down in that link you can also search for sausages by country of origin. Over the past 15 years hundreds of recipes have also been posted on this forum. You can use the search function if you are looking for a particular sausage or read the post in the different sub forums. If you tell us what types of sausage you would like to make, we can certainly help with suggestions.
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Hello

Post by amandajams937 » Wed Oct 06, 2021 16:29

Its nice to be here and hoping to learn and share some new stuff here
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by Hojdiinnz » Thu Oct 07, 2021 01:11

Kia Ora from New Zealand,
I guess due to my mixed and somewhat 'untraceable' European heritage, I always had an interest in dried meats and salamis. I even once started a butchery with the goal to produce dried meats to sell commercially, however, the butchery got too busy and I never ended up 'going big' with dried meats. The butchery is in the past (working back in an office), but the passion is still there. When I came across this site... I was blown away by the amount of information and the willingness of curing enthusiasts to share their knowledge - heaps of thanks to all of you - reading your post has rekindled my passion and I'm getting ready to make my own salamis and cured meats. Step one - setting up the curing chamber :-). Kia kaha (stay strong)!
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by redzed » Thu Oct 07, 2021 17:55

Hey Amandajams937 and Hojdiinnz welcome to the forum! Start cranking out the sausages and show us your stuff! Don't hesitate to ask if you need any help or advice. I'm also getting ready to start up a new curing chamber and get back to making salami type products. But right now it's wine making season and I'm busy with fermenting over 800lbs of grapes.
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by Links » Sun Oct 10, 2021 05:04

Hi everyone,

I’m new to the forum but not sausage making. I’ve been at it since 1989 when my parents brought me a chorizo making kit from Spain. I have read several of Fidel Toldra and Marianski brothers books and make mostly dry cured sausages. I just moved to the US from Europe and am getting my curing cabinet set up. I’m finding it difficult to source certain things in the US like fresh fat back (a supermarket staple throughout most of Europe) but I’ll figure it out. I look forward to learning something new and to sharing some knowledge with the forum.
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by Lorenzoid » Thu Oct 14, 2021 19:10

Links wrote:
Sun Oct 10, 2021 05:04
Hi everyone,

I’m new to the forum but not sausage making. I’ve been at it since 1989 when my parents brought me a chorizo making kit from Spain. I have read several of Fidel Toldra and Marianski brothers books and make mostly dry cured sausages. I just moved to the US from Europe and am getting my curing cabinet set up. I’m finding it difficult to source certain things in the US like fresh fat back (a supermarket staple throughout most of Europe) but I’ll figure it out. I look forward to learning something new and to sharing some knowledge with the forum.
I suspect the farther south one goes in the US Southeast, the easier it is to find fatback.

You mentioned Switzerland in another post--is that where you were living? Welcome. I'm relatively new to the board, too.
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by Links » Mon Oct 18, 2021 01:15

Actually I lived in Southern Germany for 8 years, very close to France and Switzerland. We would go shopping in France on weekends (better wine and cheese). Before that I lived in Saudi Arabia, Spain, and Greece. When I go to Florida this winter I’ll look for fatback and jowls.
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by Hojdiinnz » Thu Nov 11, 2021 09:40

redzed wrote:
Thu Oct 07, 2021 17:55
Hey Amandajams937 and Hojdiinnz welcome to the forum! Start cranking out the sausages and show us your stuff! Don't hesitate to ask if you need any help or advice. I'm also getting ready to start up a new curing chamber and get back to making salami type products. But right now it's wine making season and I'm busy with fermenting over 800lbs of grapes.
Hi RedZed,

How are you getting on with your grapes? I hope you have more success than I have currently :-).

I finally set up my curing chamber and have the first two batches of salamis in it. One without starter culture and one with Kefir and Dextrose as a starter culture.
Now after 4 days the batch without starter culture is kind of yellowish, has still a PH of 5.6, is sticky and starting to get some white/grey fuzzy mould on it and has an unpleasant smell.

The Kefir batch looks quite nice and red and is only slightly sticky, with some white mould starting to show - PH 4.9.

Is the yellow sticky batch off and does it need to be discarded, or can it be saved?

Any help is appreciated :-),
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by redzed » Thu Nov 11, 2021 18:40

Interesting! Tell me more about the fermenting process you used on both. Starting pH, curing method, fermentation temps, and how much and type of sugar added. What are the parameters in the chamber?
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by Hojdiinnz » Fri Nov 12, 2021 05:44

redzed wrote:
Thu Nov 11, 2021 18:40
Interesting! Tell me more about the fermenting process you used on both. Starting pH, curing method, fermentation temps, and how much and type of sugar added. What are the parameters in the chamber?
Recipe from Swiss Butcher Association:
20gr Nitrit Salt
7gr salt
Total 27gr salt, I had to adjust Nitrit Salt to Praque #1 equivalent as Swiss Nitrit Salt has much less Nitrit.

Hence:
24gr Salt, 3gr Praque #1
2gr pepper
1gr garlic
5gr red wine

Batch one as above, batch 2 the same plus 13gr dextrose and 30ml Kefir. Used Whey on skin to promote mould growth on both batches (probably won't do this again and try to source mould 600).

1. First 14 hours at 12d Celsius and 70% RH
2. then 4 days at 20d C and 90% RH
3. now until 30% weight loss at 12d C and 75-80% RH

Weight loss after 5 days is 12% for batch one and 16% for batch two.

Washed batch one this morning, sticky stuff washed off easily and now 12 hours later don't smell 'much' anymore... will keep my eyes on it and may still have to discard them as PH is too high and I am not sure if it properly fermented.

That's all :)
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by Hojdiinnz » Sat Nov 13, 2021 01:14

Hojdiinnz wrote:
Fri Nov 12, 2021 05:44
redzed wrote:
Thu Nov 11, 2021 18:40
Interesting! Tell me more about the fermenting process you used on both. Starting pH, curing method, fermentation temps, and how much and type of sugar added. What are the parameters in the chamber?
Recipe from Swiss Butcher Association:
20gr Nitrit Salt
7gr salt
Total 27gr salt, I had to adjust Nitrit Salt to Praque #1 equivalent as Swiss Nitrit Salt has much less Nitrit.

Hence:
24gr Salt, 3gr Praque #1
2gr pepper
1gr garlic
5gr red wine

Batch one as above, batch 2 the same plus 13gr dextrose and 30ml Kefir. Used Whey on skin to promote mould growth on both batches (probably won't do this again and try to source mould 600).

Start - Batch 1: 5.82 - Batch 2: 5.79

1. First 14 hours at 12d Celsius and 70% RH - after 14 hours PH: 1: 5.93 2: 5.81
2. then 4 days at 20d C and 90% RH PH after 52 hours 1: 5.58 2: 5.28
3. now until 30% weight loss at 12d C and 75-80% RH after 4 days PH 1: 5.6 2: 5.00


PH after 6 days PH: 1: 5.7 2: 5.0


Weight loss after 5 days is 12% for batch one and 16% for batch two.

Washed batch one this morning, sticky stuff washed off easily and now 12 hours later don't smell 'much' anymore... will keep my eyes on it and may still have to discard them as PH is too high and I am not sure if it properly fermented.

That's all :)
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by redzed » Sat Nov 13, 2021 19:09

What was the starting pH in the sausages? And how are you measuring your pH? The biggest issues I see in in your process are following:

1. No sugars in the first batch. There is not enough glycogen left in the meat to initiate fermentation. Some lactic bacteria are probably there, but there is not enough sugar for it to multiply. Since you did not use any starter cultures, it would would have been better to pre-cure the meat for 2-3 days in the fridge for safety reasons, add 3-5g of glucose (depending on your starting pH) and ferment at 20-22C.

2. While you didn't add any sugar to the first sausage, you really went to town with the second one. 13g is way to much unless you like a sour sausage (think Danish salami). I don't know what your staring pH was, but if it was 5.8, 8-10g is usually enough to lower the pH to 4-5, which is as low as it can go since lactic bacteria stop growing in a high acid environment.

3. Kefir is probably not well suited as a starter for salami type products. It contains a whole smorgasbord of lactic bacteria and yeasts and not all work well in meat. Most will not provide any benefit, and some can produce off-flavours. Using a yogourt with live cultures of bacteria that are compatible with meat fermentation would have been a better choice. You fermentation temp also might have been higher since the bacteria in kefir (and yogourt) are thermophilic and do better at higher temps.

4. In summary, I think you would be better off with using a commercial starter culture. Your success rate would be almost guaranteed, you would have consistency and traditional flavours, as well as a large layer of protection from unwanted and potetially unsafe bacteria. With the cost of meat these days, buying a packet of a starter culture is a small price to pay.
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Re: Hi New Guys - Introduce Yourself

Post by Hojdiinnz » Sat Nov 13, 2021 19:54

Thank you very much for your reply. I completely agree, in the future I will certainly use a commercial starter.... I have learned my lesson 😁.
Starting PH were 5.82 for batch 1 and 5.79 for batch 2. I use a Hanna meat pH meter and stick it into the salami to measure the PH.
I measured the PH of an imported Italian salami the other day and it was 5.75. This surprised me as I read everywhere that it should be lower than 5.3 to be food safe?? Does PH go up again after fermentation and curing?
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