So after much research, prep and planning, yesterday i finally began my first batch of dry cured sausage based on the "Basic Salami" recipe in Ruhlman's "Salumi". Without even realizing it until AFTER the sausages were hanging in the fermenting chamber, the recipe did NOT call for dextrose or any other sugar. is this batch a complete waste? Is there ANY chance for success? I'm really disappointed about this. I knew better but for some reason just had my blinders on when I started the recipe and didn't notice till after the fact. Any suggestions? Thanks all,
Bill
I think I screwed up
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Butterbean
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Butterbean
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Meat has sugar in it. I know some people who still make it the old traditional ways that did not employ the understanding we have today and theirs seems to work fine - most of the time.
Some may argue the merits of the "old ways" and cast stones at the understanding we have today of the science but I argue that today we understand things much better and we understand the chemistry much better than they did in "the day". With this understanding we are able to assist mother nature to insure predictable outcomes. Same with cures, isn't it better to know how much nitrite is going into your product rather than taking a chance that the salt in the shovel came from the right depth in the salt vein?
Adding additional sugar is akin to adding sugar during the making of fruit wine. The added sugar is there to assist and insure the yeast has plenty of feed which prevents the foul taste of starved yeast. You can make it without the addition but you buy insurance by adding it.
Some may argue the merits of the "old ways" and cast stones at the understanding we have today of the science but I argue that today we understand things much better and we understand the chemistry much better than they did in "the day". With this understanding we are able to assist mother nature to insure predictable outcomes. Same with cures, isn't it better to know how much nitrite is going into your product rather than taking a chance that the salt in the shovel came from the right depth in the salt vein?
Adding additional sugar is akin to adding sugar during the making of fruit wine. The added sugar is there to assist and insure the yeast has plenty of feed which prevents the foul taste of starved yeast. You can make it without the addition but you buy insurance by adding it.
The section about starter cultures in Salumi is totally inadequate in its explanation to the novice user. They recommend only one culture F-RM-52, which is fast acting and produces a sour flavour. A high temp in fermenting products is also suggested, and this will result in an even greater degree of sourness. There is no discussion about using slower acting cultures and their relation to producing a more mild flavoured, less tangy and more traditional salami. The authors further instruct that Cure #2 be used in the salami recipes, yet the manufacturer of Bactoferm F-RM-52 advises Cure #1, because it is such a fast acting culture.
While the book is useful in gleaning the recipes for the different spice and herb combinations, you need to go elsewhere for learning the process.
Can you provide more information as to which culture you actually used, the size of your casing and the temp in your fermentation chamber? Did you check the starting pH?
While the book is useful in gleaning the recipes for the different spice and herb combinations, you need to go elsewhere for learning the process.
Can you provide more information as to which culture you actually used, the size of your casing and the temp in your fermentation chamber? Did you check the starting pH?
Thanks to both of you for your help in this matter. As far as my experience with dry curing goes, I'm a novice. Obviously I've read "Salumi" but i've also read "The art of Fermentation" and "Home Production of Quality Meats". Although both of those are a wealth of information, I sometimes get confused as to whether they are referring to "commercial" or "at home" practices because they seem to jump around quite a bit.
In the end, based on simplicity and the fact that this was my first attempt, I decided to follow the recipe for "Simple Salami" in the "Salumi" book. I used F-MR-52 culture as prescribed. For the most part I do understand the difference between some of these cultures and how they work at different temps and times to lower the Ph and result in different flavors. But again, I was going for simplicity here. I figured I was going to have enough to worry about just mixing, stuffing, tying, maintaining fermentation chamber temp/humidity etc... I was actually less concerned about the flavor of the final product than I was just getting a successful dry cured salami under my belt.
As far as casing size, does 58-60 sound right? It looks to be about 2" - 2 1/4" dia. but i tossed the original packaging away. And no, I'm afraid I did not check pH. I'm very confused with regard to how to check pH. I mean, once you've stuffed the mix into the casing, how do you check pH after fermentation? I went through those books several times looking for how to test for pH and all I came up with was mix one part meat mixture with two parts distilled water to make a slurry then test with pH strips. That makes perfect sense for a starting pH but what about after fermentation? I know you must be rolling your eyes at me right now!
Cuz there is probably some simple way to do this. Sorry. Fermentation temp was 80-85F and humidity was around 80-90%. Thanks again for all your help. Please let me know if you have any more book recommendations as well.
Bill
In the end, based on simplicity and the fact that this was my first attempt, I decided to follow the recipe for "Simple Salami" in the "Salumi" book. I used F-MR-52 culture as prescribed. For the most part I do understand the difference between some of these cultures and how they work at different temps and times to lower the Ph and result in different flavors. But again, I was going for simplicity here. I figured I was going to have enough to worry about just mixing, stuffing, tying, maintaining fermentation chamber temp/humidity etc... I was actually less concerned about the flavor of the final product than I was just getting a successful dry cured salami under my belt.
As far as casing size, does 58-60 sound right? It looks to be about 2" - 2 1/4" dia. but i tossed the original packaging away. And no, I'm afraid I did not check pH. I'm very confused with regard to how to check pH. I mean, once you've stuffed the mix into the casing, how do you check pH after fermentation? I went through those books several times looking for how to test for pH and all I came up with was mix one part meat mixture with two parts distilled water to make a slurry then test with pH strips. That makes perfect sense for a starting pH but what about after fermentation? I know you must be rolling your eyes at me right now!
Cuz there is probably some simple way to do this. Sorry. Fermentation temp was 80-85F and humidity was around 80-90%. Thanks again for all your help. Please let me know if you have any more book recommendations as well. Bill
wilburwb wrote:T. I'm very confused with regard to how to check pH. I mean, once you've stuffed the mix into the casing, how do you check pH after fermentation? I went through those books several times looking for how to test for pH and all I came up with was mix one part meat mixture with two parts distilled water to make a slurry then test with pH strips. That makes perfect sense for a starting pH but what about after fermentation? I know you must be rolling your eyes at me right now!
Bill
What I do is: put a portion of the mix into a plastic baggie and seal. Then keep with the chubs you are fermenting. You can check the Ph before, during and after fermenting to check the progress.
I don't have a probe for checking the chubs and that method seems to work with Ph papers.
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Igor Duńczyk
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Hi Bill,
To judge from your description I don´t notice any major upscrewing, unless you have used loads od dextrose. By that I mean exceeding app. 5 gr pr. kg because once you get above that, a fast culture will have almost too much to thrive on and you may end up with a rather tangy taste. How much sugar/dextrose did you eventually add ?
My mantra for a beginner will always be: KEEP UP HUMIDITY ON MAX for the first 48 to 72 hours. The result of too low humidity may be a dry rim under the casing preventing moisture to escape once the fermentation is done - and then the salumi will be really screwed up!!
I´d say; regard 90% as minimum and try to get it up to 95% at least during the first 36 hours. Also, despite the cons in terms of less time for colour- and aroma formation the fast cultures secures an even pH drop throughout the whole mass, thus reducing the risc of dry rim formation. So with Bactoferm F-RM-52 you are playing safe. Once you have more experience with the fermentation process you can change to the slower cultures.
As for pH metering I´m rather sceptical about the slurry method. You should not mess with the original composition!
If being short of a pH meter with probe I´d much rather stick to Bob´s baggy-method.
But a pH meter is the best -providing that you are willing to invest.
I think Red has some recommendations on internet offers. (Am I right, Red ...?)
To judge from your description I don´t notice any major upscrewing, unless you have used loads od dextrose. By that I mean exceeding app. 5 gr pr. kg because once you get above that, a fast culture will have almost too much to thrive on and you may end up with a rather tangy taste. How much sugar/dextrose did you eventually add ?
My mantra for a beginner will always be: KEEP UP HUMIDITY ON MAX for the first 48 to 72 hours. The result of too low humidity may be a dry rim under the casing preventing moisture to escape once the fermentation is done - and then the salumi will be really screwed up!!
I´d say; regard 90% as minimum and try to get it up to 95% at least during the first 36 hours. Also, despite the cons in terms of less time for colour- and aroma formation the fast cultures secures an even pH drop throughout the whole mass, thus reducing the risc of dry rim formation. So with Bactoferm F-RM-52 you are playing safe. Once you have more experience with the fermentation process you can change to the slower cultures.
As for pH metering I´m rather sceptical about the slurry method. You should not mess with the original composition!
If being short of a pH meter with probe I´d much rather stick to Bob´s baggy-method.
But a pH meter is the best -providing that you are willing to invest.
I think Red has some recommendations on internet offers. (Am I right, Red ...?)
Wishing you a Good Day!
Igor The Dane
Igor The Dane
Igor, the OP did not add any dextrose to the meat mixture, and asked whether fermentation will still occur. And that is a very good question. How well do the sugars that are naturally found in the meat, react with an introduced bacteria?
As to using strips to test for pH, I hated using them and was not confident of their accuracy. But I know that many individuals use them and successfully in their efforts. I guess that not just any brand of strips will work. Marianski recommends the pHydrion brand. It is also carried by Sausagemaker http://www.sausagemaker.com19003phydrio ... range.aspx so they have a degree of credibility. And I really can't recommend a Ph meter. I'm sure the best one out there is made by Hanna, but there are a couple of other less expensive ones out there that probably will work well for the hobbyist.
As to testing the salami, I do what Bob K does, but just a bit differently. I save about 10 or 12 decagrams of meat left over from the stuffer, place it into a small bowl and cover with parchment paper. Just like the cased sausages, the meat needs to dry and I see no reason to encase it in plastic. The bowl is placed in the fermentation chamber and I take the pH reading from this meat rather than jabbing the sausages. I take a reading every 12 hours during the fermentation stage. The bowl with the sample meat is later transferred into the curing chamber and I take a reading once a week or so. I also take whiff of it occasionally and press on it to test for firmness.
As to using strips to test for pH, I hated using them and was not confident of their accuracy. But I know that many individuals use them and successfully in their efforts. I guess that not just any brand of strips will work. Marianski recommends the pHydrion brand. It is also carried by Sausagemaker http://www.sausagemaker.com19003phydrio ... range.aspx so they have a degree of credibility. And I really can't recommend a Ph meter. I'm sure the best one out there is made by Hanna, but there are a couple of other less expensive ones out there that probably will work well for the hobbyist.
As to testing the salami, I do what Bob K does, but just a bit differently. I save about 10 or 12 decagrams of meat left over from the stuffer, place it into a small bowl and cover with parchment paper. Just like the cased sausages, the meat needs to dry and I see no reason to encase it in plastic. The bowl is placed in the fermentation chamber and I take the pH reading from this meat rather than jabbing the sausages. I take a reading every 12 hours during the fermentation stage. The bowl with the sample meat is later transferred into the curing chamber and I take a reading once a week or so. I also take whiff of it occasionally and press on it to test for firmness.
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Igor Duńczyk
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Hi Red -and a belayed THANK´s, DZIEKUJE BARDZO & MANGE TAK for your birthday Greetings 
May I return it with a WSZYSTKIEGO NAJLEPSZEGO W NOWYM ROKU!
I hope Bob read your posting better than I read his; I understood it as if Bob has added dextrose where the Ruhlman recipe called for no addition of sugars (?)
Anyway, I think I would use your pH strip metering method too if I had no meter.
Sounds reliable to me and being able to feel the consistency between ones fingers also gives a a good hint at the development of the sausage.
Now, for the content og sugars in meat and their effective influence on added starters, if might depend on who you ask, but here are my five cents:
Raw meat will always contain an amount of Glycogen. This is a polysaccharide of glycose - thus fermentable - and is stored in both muscles and in the liver which, through the enzymatic function of Glycogen phosphorylase transforms it into Glycose which we need to move and think
The residue Glucogen in muscle tissue is dependent on animal race, the animals age and the kind of muscle in question (a.e. if it is an active or rather inactive muscle), time lapse after the animals last meal, and if the animal was stressed or calm before slaughter.
The average Glycogen value of flesh with a pH of app. 7,2 and 3 hours after slaughtering should be around 1% but may be up to 3,6% (Howard & Laurie, Food Invest Spec. Rep. No.65).
Looking at Beef there can be almost eight times difference in Glycogen content in the same muscle just depending whether it´s a bull or a cow (Semitendinosus - a hindlimb muscle) the bull taking the prize in this case...
However it takes only about 40 hours before the majority of Glycogen present has been broken down, in the process producing a.o. lactic acid which explains why the pH of the meat also gradually will sink towards 5,5.
These factors have to be held up against the average minimum dosage of 0,3% added fermetable sugar which is recommended by most producers to kickstart the starter cultures. And facing the multitude of factors (which kind/age of animal and muscle, timelapse between slaughter and processing, percentage of added fat tissue -which holds no Glycogen etc.) it is always safer to add those 0,3% than to leave them out.
Also please remember that if using starter cultures in freshly slaughtered meat with a high content of Glycogen, you will also have a high pH (6,5 and above) which is a bit like pointing the gun at your own feet, because the average bacterias of most starter cultures are selected for meat that has a start pH around 6,0. And with higher pH values in the raw material you risc to increase the lag phase and delay the desired pH drop.
Now, if deployed in good average meat and totally without the addition of any fermentable sugars, the starter cultures will still do their job, but with a lag phase far too long to be acceptable for the starter culture producers, as certain evil indigenious bacteria may formate at a quicker pace than our good guys and in the end simply outperform them -resulting in a faulty fermentation. Not that this is bound to happen - it just increases the risc
May I return it with a WSZYSTKIEGO NAJLEPSZEGO W NOWYM ROKU!
I hope Bob read your posting better than I read his; I understood it as if Bob has added dextrose where the Ruhlman recipe called for no addition of sugars (?)
Anyway, I think I would use your pH strip metering method too if I had no meter.
Sounds reliable to me and being able to feel the consistency between ones fingers also gives a a good hint at the development of the sausage.
Now, for the content og sugars in meat and their effective influence on added starters, if might depend on who you ask, but here are my five cents:
Raw meat will always contain an amount of Glycogen. This is a polysaccharide of glycose - thus fermentable - and is stored in both muscles and in the liver which, through the enzymatic function of Glycogen phosphorylase transforms it into Glycose which we need to move and think
The residue Glucogen in muscle tissue is dependent on animal race, the animals age and the kind of muscle in question (a.e. if it is an active or rather inactive muscle), time lapse after the animals last meal, and if the animal was stressed or calm before slaughter.
The average Glycogen value of flesh with a pH of app. 7,2 and 3 hours after slaughtering should be around 1% but may be up to 3,6% (Howard & Laurie, Food Invest Spec. Rep. No.65).
Looking at Beef there can be almost eight times difference in Glycogen content in the same muscle just depending whether it´s a bull or a cow (Semitendinosus - a hindlimb muscle) the bull taking the prize in this case...
However it takes only about 40 hours before the majority of Glycogen present has been broken down, in the process producing a.o. lactic acid which explains why the pH of the meat also gradually will sink towards 5,5.
These factors have to be held up against the average minimum dosage of 0,3% added fermetable sugar which is recommended by most producers to kickstart the starter cultures. And facing the multitude of factors (which kind/age of animal and muscle, timelapse between slaughter and processing, percentage of added fat tissue -which holds no Glycogen etc.) it is always safer to add those 0,3% than to leave them out.
Also please remember that if using starter cultures in freshly slaughtered meat with a high content of Glycogen, you will also have a high pH (6,5 and above) which is a bit like pointing the gun at your own feet, because the average bacterias of most starter cultures are selected for meat that has a start pH around 6,0. And with higher pH values in the raw material you risc to increase the lag phase and delay the desired pH drop.
Now, if deployed in good average meat and totally without the addition of any fermentable sugars, the starter cultures will still do their job, but with a lag phase far too long to be acceptable for the starter culture producers, as certain evil indigenious bacteria may formate at a quicker pace than our good guys and in the end simply outperform them -resulting in a faulty fermentation. Not that this is bound to happen - it just increases the risc
Wishing you a Good Day!
Igor The Dane
Igor The Dane
Yes Igor I had added dextrose in the amount of 0.2% as I was using a Marianski recipe.Igor Duńczyk wrote: I hope Bob read your posting better than I read his; I understood it as if Bob has added dextrose where the Ruhlman recipe called for no addition of sugars (?)
Red - I just left the baggie unsealed as I was not sure if the culture was aerobic or not.
I do like your method better and will use next time.
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Igor Duńczyk
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Bob - don´t worry - with 0,2% you´ll probably just have triggered the culture so there should be no reason for concern as it is a fast one with a short lag phase.
In fact it might be an advantage: if the meat content of your salami is reasonably high the F-MR-52 will have less nutrition to thrive on and there´ll be less risc of overt tanginess or sournotes as can easily happen with this culture. After all Chr.Hansen themselves in their info sheet state as follows:
"The culture is recommended for the production of fast fermented North European style sausages e.g. German Mettwurst and Danish salami, but it is also well suited for the production of Mediterranean style sausages".
To me there it´s a bit wishfull thinking to offer a culture that should be able to combine those two utterly different worlds of salami taste and of course there is a reason why the words about "Mediterranean style sausage" is squeezed in at the end of the sentence.
To make a long matured Mediterranean treat you better stick to the slower T-SPX culture which is milder acidifying.
Or the slow version of the F-RM-52 which is designated F-RM-53.
Looking forward to hearing about your final pH figure.
I am far more concerned about what caused Michael Ruhlman to refrain from adding at least the minimum recommended amount of dextrose (0,3%) in his recipes
(eager to hear his answer should he happen to read this...)
In fact it might be an advantage: if the meat content of your salami is reasonably high the F-MR-52 will have less nutrition to thrive on and there´ll be less risc of overt tanginess or sournotes as can easily happen with this culture. After all Chr.Hansen themselves in their info sheet state as follows:
"The culture is recommended for the production of fast fermented North European style sausages e.g. German Mettwurst and Danish salami, but it is also well suited for the production of Mediterranean style sausages".
To me there it´s a bit wishfull thinking to offer a culture that should be able to combine those two utterly different worlds of salami taste and of course there is a reason why the words about "Mediterranean style sausage" is squeezed in at the end of the sentence.
To make a long matured Mediterranean treat you better stick to the slower T-SPX culture which is milder acidifying.
Or the slow version of the F-RM-52 which is designated F-RM-53.
Looking forward to hearing about your final pH figure.
I am far more concerned about what caused Michael Ruhlman to refrain from adding at least the minimum recommended amount of dextrose (0,3%) in his recipes
(eager to hear his answer should he happen to read this...)
Wishing you a Good Day!
Igor The Dane
Igor The Dane
Hello everyone and thanks again for all the great info. Just to update on the progress of this endeavour: I did actually contact one of the authors of "Salumi" (Chef Brian Polcyn) and he was kind enough to get back with me and advised me that there was a typo in the recipe that I was following and that dextrose should have been included. 
At this point I'm a bit concerned about case hardening. Not sure if i had the humidity high enough in the dry-cure chamber to start. Its been a week now and I just weighed them for the first time since they went in. There are three sticks hanging and they have lost between 17.5% - 20% of their initial weight. Does this sound about right? They were originally about 2 - 2 1/4" inch diameter and they are definitely narrower now. I used butcher twine with hitches to tie them up originally and the butcher twine is loose now. the casings feel rather dry but still pliable - not hard. They smell pleasantly tangy/sour. another thing is that i sprayed the 600 mold culture on them when they went into the drying chamber but that doesn't seem to have worked. no mold to be found. thanks again everyone,
Bill
At this point I'm a bit concerned about case hardening. Not sure if i had the humidity high enough in the dry-cure chamber to start. Its been a week now and I just weighed them for the first time since they went in. There are three sticks hanging and they have lost between 17.5% - 20% of their initial weight. Does this sound about right? They were originally about 2 - 2 1/4" inch diameter and they are definitely narrower now. I used butcher twine with hitches to tie them up originally and the butcher twine is loose now. the casings feel rather dry but still pliable - not hard. They smell pleasantly tangy/sour. another thing is that i sprayed the 600 mold culture on them when they went into the drying chamber but that doesn't seem to have worked. no mold to be found. thanks again everyone,Bill
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Igor Duńczyk
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Sure I didBob K wrote:Igor- I think you may have confused my post (Bob K) commenting on testing Ph with Bills (Wilburwb) original post on adding no sugar?
Sorry about that Bob - in the heat of the battle (and you do share the same initial...)
To Bill: a loss of up to 20% over a week sounds like you´re heading in the right direction.
I guess you intend to let them loose between 30 to 40% before considering the job done?
If so there should be at least 10 to 15 more days to go. Just don´t let them hang in a (too) dry ambience.
Sorry, but I have no plausible explanation about the non-growth of the mould...
Wishing you a Good Day!
Igor The Dane
Igor The Dane
