Using Potassium Sorbate.

Divey
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Using Potassium Sorbate.

Post by Divey » Mon Jun 19, 2017 02:02

I made some fresh Salami seven days ago today and they have been hanging at a temperature of 16 deg. C with humidity at 75%. When I got the Salami out of the cellar room to smoke them last Saturday, I noticed that they had a very odd array of molds. There was white dots, some very light fluffy grey mold, some black, orange and green mold. We washed them all with a mixture of olive oil an white vinegar before they were smoked with hickory for 5 hours.
The Salami all look fine at the moment, however, I have fears that these molds will reappear.
I did some searching on the web and discovered that it is recommended to wash the Salami with a solution of Potassium Sorbate that will control the mold until such time has they have cured enough to be sealed in vacuum bags.
Does anyone here use Potassium Sorbate on their Salami, and, if so, at what rate Do you use it?
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redzed
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Post by redzed » Mon Jun 19, 2017 04:42

Hi Divey,
To begin with, turn down your temp to 11-13. !5 is the maximum temp but really should be lower, especially during the first couple of weeks. If you don't want mould, the smoking should keep it in abeyance for a while, probably two three weeks. Probably not a good idea to use olive oil on the casing. The oil can block the pores, preventing drying and exposed to air at that temp it will go rancid. Where did you get that idea?

As to p. sorbate, you can use anywhere from 2% to 10%, in other words, 20 to 100g in a litre of distilled water. I think 3% should be adequate, since that is what I have been spraying my prosciutto with.
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Post by Divey » Mon Jun 19, 2017 06:32

redzed wrote:Hi Divey,
To begin with, turn down your temp to 11-13. !5 is the maximum temp but really should be lower, especially during the first couple of weeks. If you don't want mould, the smoking should keep it in abeyance for a while, probably two three weeks. Probably not a good idea to use olive oil on the casing. The oil can block the pores, preventing drying and exposed to air at that temp it will go rancid. Where did you get that idea?

As to p. sorbate, you can use anywhere from 2% to 10%, in other words, 20 to 100g in a litre of distilled water. I think 3% should be adequate, since that is what I have been spraying my prosciutto with.
The idea of oil and vinegar comes from a book I bought called "Preserving The Italian Way" by Pietro Demaio.

I can't turn the temperature down. This room is under the house and has a door we can close. I have pine wood shavings on the floor that I keep moist to keep the humidity up. We have to go with the ambient temperature at this time of the year with out set up here in Sydney Australia. It does get down to 10 deg.C outside at night.
I don't have a problem with the time that the Salami's dry as there is no hollow centres in any that I make.

I have ordered some Potassium Sorbate online and it should be here in a couple of days.

Thanks for the information as the percentage rate for the K Sorbate.

Edited to add that the book mentioned above has sold over 35,000 copies.
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Post by redzed » Mon Jun 19, 2017 15:23

Yes olive oil was used traditionally (before fridges and vac machines) to preserve meat products after they were cured/dried where they were immersed in a container of olive oil and also used after curing when the mould was brushed off and the salami was "polished" with olive oil for aesthetic reasons. Olive oil is not applied during the drying stage.
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Post by Divey » Tue Jun 20, 2017 03:18

Here is a photograph I took from the book describing what to do with the Salami when mouldy....

Image

This book is the 6th Edition and was printed in 2013.
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Post by Bob K » Tue Jun 20, 2017 11:23

Well making sopressata the Italian way is a lot like making sauce/gravy the Italian way, 10 different families will have 10 different methods and recipes. :???:

I would agree with Redzed, meats are coated with oil/grease to slow drying.

If you have used that method before, how were the results? If not it will be interesting to know the outcome. Keep us informed!!
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Post by redzed » Tue Jun 20, 2017 15:23

For mould control the combination of vinegar and olive oil will certainly do the trick. The acid in the vingar will kill exisying growth and the oil will, for a time, prevent new growth. Mould does not take too easily to oily or fatty surfaces. And if you apply this concoction there it is highly unlikely that you will need to repeat the process in 2-3 days as the book suggests. And plying the salami with the stuff will undoubtedly affect the end product. Without covering of a noble mould you are missing out on the flavour imparted by surface proteolytic activity and slower drying. Oiling the casing during the dryin stage makes little scientific sense and is not practised by industry.

But I'm certainly interested in how your salami turns out. Make sure you file a report and post pictures! :grin:
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Post by Divey » Thu Jun 22, 2017 03:06

My Potassium Sorbate that I bought on-line has not arrived as yet so I decided to give the Salamis another wipe down with white vinegar.
Here is a photograph of the mold before wiping and another photograph after.
I'm rather pleased with the way they are curing.


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Post by redzed » Fri Jun 23, 2017 15:06

Salami does look good at this stage. Looks like you had a good ferment and colour development. But you got to let the mould develop. You will have better tasting and more evenly dried sausages. Continually wiping with vinegar not only removes mould, bu also prevents other good bacteria, enzymes and yeasts to do their magic. Get some surface starter and let the good moulds grow.
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Post by Divey » Sat Jun 24, 2017 23:25

I now have the Potassium Sorbate, is it preferable to spray the 3% solution onto the Salamis or wipe them?
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Post by redzed » Sun Jun 25, 2017 16:00

Best way would be to spray on or dip in solution.
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Post by Divey » Fri Jul 21, 2017 01:27

The salami has finished its curing stage and has no been vacuum packed and in the cool room.

As requested, here is a pic of the completed Salami.


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Post by Butterbean » Fri Jul 21, 2017 20:44

Nice work!
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Post by harleykids » Wed Aug 09, 2017 22:03

Divey,

How was your salumi? Taste good? Did you ever use p. sorbate on those?

Have you made any new batches using your potassium sorbate?
I would be very interested to hear how well the 3% p. sorbate worked for inhibiting white mold (good mold) growth during the entire drying process?

And any difference in taste that was noticeable, from the P. sorbate?

Or anyone else use p. sorbate to inhibit good mold growth on the casing of their salumi?
And how did it work?

Thanks!
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Post by Divey » Thu Aug 10, 2017 01:16

Thanks for the Photobucket folks to turn into a bunch of jerks. I'm not paying any money for their photosharing rip offs. I shall now go back and delete the photobucket photographs and insert photgraphs with another photosharing website, IMGUR.
Sorry about that little rant.

Yes, this is a recipe that I have used for quite a few years now. There's nothing fancy about the recipe and it was given to me by an Italian family.

The salami tastes great and is a big hit with everyone that has tried it.

In the past I have used straight vinegar to combat the mould, however, the mould comes back just about straight away. I did some googling about mould on Salami and discovered the use of Potassium Sorbate. It's not so much the white mould I'm worried about but there are many other various colors which I don't like.

There is absolutely no taste difference when using Potassium Sorbate. The 3% Solution when mixed up has no smell at all.

I will use it again as it works much better than White Vinegar.
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