Looking For Nathan's Famous Frankfurter

SmokinJoeM · Post by **SmokinJoeM** » Wed Jan 02, 2013 15:18

Hello Everyone...

I am glad to be associated with this wonderful and informative group of enthusiasts!

I am looking for a recipe (or very close approximation) for either of the following brands of hot dogs. In New York, we have many styles, but I have not been able to find a recipe that matches the taste and texture.

I believe the spice mix is rather simple (but I am not sure) and doesn't include things that I have seen in other hot dog recipes, e.g. Mace, Celery seed or Mustard seed and other spices... another important question is amounts of what ever these illusive spices are...

Your vast knowledge base would be of great assistance.

The All Beef "Nathan's Famous" or
The All Beef "Hebrew National"

Regards, Joe

ssorllih · Post by **ssorllih** » Wed Jan 02, 2013 15:49

Joe , welcome to our treasure house. Signature flavors are the most closely guarded industrial secrets. I can only suggest that you start with making small batches starting with this: http://www.wedlinydomowe.com/sausage-recipes/hotdog and change only one ingredient at a time. One kilogram batches are a good size. We have discussed the option of making a very basic recipe and dividing it into half pound portions and seasoning each portion differently. Labeling and record keeping would be of prime importance. You will need a milligram scale.
You will probably make more hotdogs than you want to eat but there is no shortage of hungry street people that would be glad to help you with your failures.

Baconologist · Post by **Baconologist** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 03:33

Bull meat is one of the secrets.
Commercial maker's now often use spice extractives, so the flavor profile can be somewhat different than when using the real thing.
If you'll send me a PM, I'll forward a starter recipe that you can work with.

ssorllih · Post by **ssorllih** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 04:45

FRANKFURTERS (mixed beef/pork product)

(Raw-cooked sausage type, finely chopped batter)

INGREDIENTS

Raw materials:
(calculated for 30 kg batch)

30.00 %
Pork meat trimmings, lean
9.000 kg

20.00 %
Beef meat trimmings, lean
6.000 kg

25.00 %
Fatty pork tissues
7.500 kg

25.00 %
Ice (drinking water)
7.500 kg

Additives:

(per kg of raw materials)
(total for 30 kg)

18.00 g
Nitrite curing salt
540.00 g

3.00 g
Phosphate (pH >7.3)
90.00 g

0.30 g
Ascorbic acid
9.00 g

Seasonings:

(per kg of raw materials)
(total for 30 kg)

3.00 g
White pepper, ground
90.00 g

1.00 g
Nutmeg, ground
30.00 g

0.50 g
Cardamom, ground
15.00 g

0.20 g
Coriander, ground
6.00 g

PROCESSING

GRIND
Meats and fats separately 3 mm

CHILL
Meats and fats over night at < +4°C

CHOP
Ground meat, ice and additives for 10-15 rounds

Add fats and seasonings and chop until +12°C

STUFF
Sheep casings (24/26 mm) or pig casings (26/28 mm)

LINK
To desired length and twist

SMOKE
At +65°C for 40 min.

COOK
In water or steam +76°C for > 30 min.

(core temperature > +72°C for all products)

COOL
Under cold shower or in water until <+20°C

STORE
In chiller below +4°C, shelf life < 14 days
This is a recipe from the food and agriculture organization of the UN for Asian and Far eastern developement. Between this and the recipe in the link I posted earlier you should have a good starting point. You will have to calculate the nitrite content to fit USA cure#1. Limit Cure#1 to 2.5 grams per kilogram of meat

ssorllih · Post by **ssorllih** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 04:50

Link to the entire FAO manual http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/ai407e/AI ... m#Contents

Chuckwagon · Post by **Chuckwagon** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 06:23

Baconologist wrote:

If you'll send me a PM, I'll forward a starter recipe that you can work with.

Baconologist,
I`ve noticed that you`ve often had people "PM" you for specific information. Is there a reason you don`t share with ALL members of this forum? Gosh, these other folks just might appreciate your input also.

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon

Chuckwagon · Post by **Chuckwagon** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 06:33

Hi SmokinjoeM,
We have a terrific index of recipes by the members of this forum. Here`s a handy link: http://wedlinydomowe.pl/en/viewtopic.php?t=5146
There are all-beef sausages in the collection and one of the all-beef frankfurters is my own recipe called "Hobble Creek Hot Dogs". How about giving it a try and see how they compare? I think you`ll be surprised. Here`s a link for the hot dogs: http://wedlinydomowe.pl/en/viewtopic.php?p=2249#2249

Best Wishes,
Chuckwagon

el Ducko · Post by **el Ducko** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 08:09

One possible factor (and frankly (heh heh) one that I'll never understand about New Yorkers) is the "dirty water" hot dog that we hear so much about.

...hope that's not a major factor! You be the judge.

Baconologist · Post by **Baconologist** » Mon Jan 07, 2013 02:08

Sent!

ssorllih · Post by **ssorllih** » Mon Jan 07, 2013 19:11

Baconologist wrote:Sent!

Thanks for sharing.

nickodin · Post by **nickodin** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 01:51

Baconologist, hello. may i ask u a question... why when i make a frankfurter my sausage become very oily and watery in the casing... is it because of the emulsion or anything..can u help

Post by **redzed** » Mon Nov 02, 2015 07:00

Hello nickodin and welcome to the forum! Looks like the Baconologist is on sabbatical these days.

To answer your question, it definitely sounds like a problem with the temperature that the meat was emulsified. When you start, you should be at 0°C and never go above 14°. At temperatures 15° and above the emulsion will break and you will have a separation of the fat, meat and water. And in domestic situation it is best not to go over 10% water and use crushed or shaved ice. Other factors such as type of meat used and the fat to meat ratio should also be considered. Making emulsified sausages is a bit tricky and it usually takes a few tries until we master the technique. Take a look at this page for more info.
http://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausage ... ed-sausage

Let us know if you have any other questions and tell us about your sausage making adventures in Malaysia.

Best wishes,
redzed