Smoked Ham - Kassler

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Bubba
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Post by Bubba » Thu Oct 13, 2011 13:41

Siara wrote:Few photos of similar product from our polish forum.
Below cold smoked pork loin
Siara,
Those look fantastic! I followed the link in your posting, and in the hand written notes saw temperature ranges between 30 - 35 C (85 - 95 F). Earlier on it refers to 25 C (77 F)
I assume these are the cold smoking temperatures along with the times given?

Chuckwagon wrote:A couple of thin slices on a crescent roll with just a dab of mustard
Chuckwagon,
:grin: That's what I'm wanting to have as well, except I love them on a freshly baked Kaiser Roll.
Ron
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Post by Siara » Thu Oct 13, 2011 15:23

Bubba wrote:I assume these are the cold smoking temperatures along with the times given?
Bubba, correct, so ligawa says that he is drying in 30C to 35C for 2.5 - 3 hours, then smoking in 25C to 30C for 10 to 12 hours 2 times ( two days in a row ).
Better results he gets when smoking in 25C.
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Post by snagman » Sun Oct 30, 2011 23:50

Bubba wrote: This was my weekend's project, I have made brined - smoked Ham before to a Kassler recipe. I am posting the recipe below, my Grandmother or any other Family member claiming to be my family (*) has no say in this one after conquering all the hurdles myself to render a fine tasting Kassler Ham.
(*) Bubba's disclaimer
Bubba,

Using your recipe, the kassler was brined for 10 days, 10% injected, smoked for 24hrs, only at night, drying between. The pellet smoker added 8 deg C to ambient temperature, which dropped to 14 deg C each night, so no need for the ice treatment in this case. I know you are looking at the ice to assist your cold smoking. I found that there is a temp drop of 8 deg C using one 1.5L bottle, and with vents open will last for around 6 hours. Adding salt to the water slows the ice melt. If my smoker was big enough, I would buy a block of ice, wrap in hessian, should last days.
Overall, very happy with the result, nice balance of moisture, not wet, not dry. It is slightly too salty, next one will have more sugar in the brine.
So, good recipe Ron, couldn't help but eat a couple of kassler/Masdaam/Toasts for breakfast today ....
Regards, Gus

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Post by Bubba » Mon Oct 31, 2011 00:52

Hi Gus,

Your Kassler looks far better than mine, and the difference will be the low temperature and length of time you slow smoked at. I will use your method next time.

Thank you also for the info on the temperature drop with the Ice water bottle, and yes salt water will be preferred.

One question on the Kassler being slightly too salty, was that directly after smoking?
I found on mine the same thing, then when I let it rest in the Refrigerator for a day or two, it had "normalized".

I'm glad you liked the recipe. :smile:
Ron
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Post by uwanna61 » Mon Oct 31, 2011 00:54

Wow that looks absolutely amazing!
I`m amazed at the skills and talent from the folks here in the US and the folks across the big pond, Poland and beyond. Makes one proud to be a part of this group..

Wally
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Post by snagman » Mon Oct 31, 2011 01:00

Bubba wrote:Hi Gus,

Your Kassler looks far better than mine, and the difference will be the low temperature and length of time you slow smoked at. I will use your method next time.

Thank you also for the info on the temperature drop with the Ice water bottle, and yes salt water will be preferred.

One question on the Kassler being slightly too salty, was that directly after smoking?
I found on mine the same thing, then when I let it rest in the Refrigerator for a day or two, it had "normalized".

I'm glad you liked the recipe. :smile:
Ron, Thank you for the comments. Yes, immediately after smoking I tasted it and found it too salty. Today, three days after that, it is still too salty, ( though you are spot on, a bit less so ). I am hoping that it may be even less in a few more days.
Regards, Gus
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Post by snagman » Mon Oct 31, 2011 01:01

uwanna61 wrote:Wow that looks absolutely amazing!
I`m amazed at the skills and talent from the folks here in the US and the folks across the big pond, Poland and beyond. Makes one proud to be a part of this group..

Wally
And, I reckon Wally, you could teach us a thing or two as well ..............

Regards, Gus
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Cold Smoked pork loins recipe?

Post by NaughtyPork » Sat Nov 30, 2013 14:44

I really want to try making the cold smoked pork loins in Siaras post but where can I find an English language recipe? They look fantastic!
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Re: Cold Smoked pork loins recipe?

Post by redzed » Sun Dec 01, 2013 09:02

NaughtyPork wrote:I really want to try making the cold smoked pork loins in Siaras post but where can I find an English language recipe? They look fantastic!
There is no recipe provided for the loin by gasmil. He only writes that he smoked it at 30°C for 8 hours. Frankly, the piece looks quite raw to me.

Ligawa provides a more detailed recipe for his loin. I will summarize it for you.
First the loin is trimmed completely of all fat and silver skin as well as the strip of the darker meat. He uses the the wet cure method. Ingredients per 1 litre of water:
*Salt 50g
*Cure 1 - 5g
*Brown sugar (amount not given)

Meat is cured for 5 -8 days at 6-8°C
Brine is then allowed to run off and the meat is wiped with paper towels and dried at 30 - 35° for 2.5 to 3 hrs. Smoked over two sessions of 10-12hrs at 25-30°. He uses alder with a sprinkling of juniper berries.

Please note that I simply translated the recipe here and must editorialize that the amount of cure in the brine is dangerously low. Please take a look at Marianski's recipe on this site http://www.meatsandsausages.com/hams-ot ... oin-smoked
And Chuckwagon's version http://wedlinydomowe.pl/en/viewtopic.ph ... ght=#21252

I don't know how experienced you are, but would recommend that if you are a beginner, start with hot smoking loins before experimenting with cold smoke.
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Re: Cold Smoked pork loins recipe?

Post by NaughtyPork » Sun Dec 01, 2013 15:46

redzed wrote: Frankly, the piece looks quite raw to me.
Indeed, it's supposed to look raw, because I think the intent was to make something like lososiowa which is a cold smoked raw cured loin. It's eaten like smoked salmon, thinly sliced, and raw. Sounds from your summary like its a straight basic wet cure followed by a cold smoke. About the nitrite being dangerously low, he is using a whole muscle cut, so really no danger there at all unless the loin has been badly butchered or trimmed and has pockets in the meat. Botulism only multiplies in an anaerobic environment, and all the spores that would be present on a whole muscle cut are on the outside - or exposed to air. If its sufficient pink salt to achieve the degree of curing desired, then its sufficient for all intensive purposes. I thought there was more to the aromatics than tossing juniper berries in the smoke! Anyways will def try it at the smoking times indicated and see what comes out, beautiful looking product!

I dry cure uncooked pork products regularly (as in every day), and I don't use any kind of pink salt on whole muscles that are cured intact.
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Post by redzed » Sun Dec 01, 2013 19:45

According to the tables of the Polish site, smoking at a temp of 30-35° is classified as warm smoking rather than cold.
Cold smoking - up to 22°
Warm smoking - 23° - 45°
Hot smoking - over 45°

As to my comment that the gasmil loin looks raw I stand by it, but what I meant is that I don't think it was finished. 8 hours of smoke (cold or warm) on a loin that was not trimmed of the fat and membrane is not enough. The process should result in a certain amount of drying, up to 10% of the starting weight, and I don't see that in the pic. I also realize that the products we are discussing are for polędwica łososiowa and traditionally no nitrites/nitrates were used. However, most commercially produced products today do have them.

Unfortunately I don't have the luxury of sourcing pork loins from a freshly processed carcass but buy them in supermarkets not frozen in vacuum sealed bags. To be on the safe side I always use Cure # 1 or 2 when preparing loins. And factory produced pork is almost tasteless so the nitrites do impart some flavour to it.
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